Note: In proper OS X Applications, holding Option while pressing the zoom button maximizes the window to full screen.
Citation:
http://safari.oreilly.com/0596009410/macxtigermm-APP-F
Martin - your first suggestion is a great one.
Why can’t we have key-bindings for one of the most frequently used task on the computer. Start-1, Start-2 (or better yet configure it per program group example: configure Start-W always tiles all instances of Word)
Maybe that’s why they implemented it in Vista. Window + 1 will run the first thing in the quick-launch, Window + 2 will launch the second and so on.
Hmm i happened to read this in firefox for linux under slackware(yes i admit im a newb) and it seems to act just like the mac. Windows resize to the size of the content. I generally don’t care: it’s just a window. As long as it gets me my data, and does what I tell it to dang it!!!
on a side note, what if the window’s content size is set to be whatever the os maximizes to? Would it expand endlessly, or just max out at the screen edges? hmmm
“Can you name one application with a multiple window interface that’s even popular?”
Gimp?
I disagree. The windows maximise button doesn’t allow you to resise without unmaximising it. This is clearly broken behaviour. I think there should be a (make window whole screen then allow me to resize it) so imo both options are broken.
In KDE (kwin window manager) the window maximize button behaves differently when clicking with the right mouse button in it (maximize only horizontally) or with the middle mouse button (maximize only vertically).
I find this feature very useful and use this often for texts (vertically) or terminals with wide output (horizontally).
Jay
Opera web browser has MDI, and it works great with big monitors. Unfortunately very few people use it. It works by automatically resizes the windows (tabs) so you can have all of them in the screen. If you have too many windows you can just minimize and all the others will resize according. If you want to have just one page in the entire screen just maximize it.
To enable this feature just go to Tools- Preferences- Advanced- Tabs- New Tabs: Tile all automatically. I really recommend you see this Jeff, but it#8217;s not nearly the same thing if you do not have one widescreen monitor, instead of yours 3 normal size ones.
I really like the way Opera works, most things it does, in the sense of usability, are great. I would love if all my windows behaved that way.
I must be brain-damaged from years of using Windows, because I like using alt-tab with a million windows open. I have developed skill in switching between two, three, four and more windows in complex variations using only alt-tab.
But that’s just me.
Wow, this topic gets people going.
I can relate. I felt so strongly about windows layouts that I wrote my own utility to give me higher-order controls than minimize, maximize, and drag. It gives you macro functions such as four kinds of tile, several alignment options, moving or resizing windows in groups, etc. It even lets you resize windows that don’t offer resize gadgets. I’ve also added the ability to set stay-on-top and transparency, which I find handy for watching a video while still working on a full-screen app. It even lets you slide a common border between two windows.
The UI could use some work, but I find it to be very handy.
Lee Grey
I like having 3 monitors because it gives 3 window ports (e.g. Maximize targets). I can have VS, Onenote, and Outlook maximized simultaneously. I wouldn’t give up my three separate monitors for one large one.
Some people seem to be comparing Microsoft’s choice in today’s environment. Of course maximise doesn’t make sense on huge screens, but back when screens were 640x480 and 800x600 (and even in most cases 1024x768) being able to make a program take up as much room as possible makes perfect sense.
Of course I would agree that it is becoming more and more redundant. However, the Macs Zoom is far from an ideal solution and a lot of Mac fans would agree it’s a broken concept because the behaviour (like a lot of things) is too inconsistent.
I agree that Apple’s solution to the problem (of “make window bigger”) is designer-centric and probably should be user-centric. Maximize sucks too, however.
I disagree that multiple overlapping windows is hopelessly confusing. I am undoubtedly a “sophisticated computer user”, but I have no trouble dealing with the (squished) three dimensions of window positioning. I mitigate confusion in a couple ways.
First, I keep all of my apps in the same places over time. My instant messaging contact list is always on the right side of the screen, IRC is always in the lower left, Firefox is always front and center, TextMate is a bit off to the right so I can see my first terminal window on the left side, etc. This familiar placement of specific apps for certain tasks makes things very fluid.
Second, I never use the mouse to navigate around my workspace. Never. I am a die-hard CMD+Tab (formerly ALT+Tab) and CMD+` user. As a coder, I spend easily 80% of my time in front of my computer with my hands exclusively on my keyboard. The mouse is reserved for those strange spatial tasks like browsing a web page or manipulating an image in Photoshop. I think any power user can achieve a level of extreme productivity and efficiency through persistent use of the keyboard over the mouse, in addition to consistent window positioning.
That said, one thing that does suck about the current UIs for my purposes is window resizing. I wish resizing were somehow vastly easier. Maybe a key combo combined with the mouse. Or some sexy gestures like on the iPhone. One can hope that Apple will make strides toward a solution for this problem in the near future.
“Fitt’s law applies in Windows when you maximize a window. Fitt’s law doesn’t apply on a mac when you want to use one of those three buttons.”
Well, true. In Windows, you can use Fitt’s Law in four specific cases:
- Opening the Start menu
- Closing a Maximized window
- Minimizing a Maximized window
- “Restoring” a Maximized window
If you do ANY of these four, or even the sum total of these four, more than you access menus in the menu bar, I’d love to see how you work.
For every time you hit the Start menu, there should be dozens of application interactions. For every time you close a window, you should have done something in that window dozens of times. Not everything you do in a window requires using the menu bar, of course. But I’ve never seen someone do these four things more than they use the menu bar.
Note, of course, that the “I never mouse to the menu bar; I use keyboard controls instead” doesn’t reverse this. If you are apt to use keyboard controls then most likely you know the keyboard controls for these four actions as well, right? So, Fitts’ Law comes to a complete bust for you when you’re working in the applications you know, but it’s still there when working in an application you don’t know.
“You don’t need to make the script yourself, e.g. have a look at Spooky.”
Ah, nice.
http://www.doernte.net/spooky.html
Requires a bit of setup, but still, it saves writing those scripts yourself if you really have the need for it. I think I’ll play with it a while, as it might be useful at times (not the maximizing part, but the movement to corners, etc).
Fitt’s law applies in Windows when you maximize a window. Fitt’s law doesn’t apply on a mac when you want to use one of those three buttons. It’s almost as if every usability decision has tradeoffs. Maybe someday Macintosh fans will understand this. Like the delightful slide-down alert window, which obscures the contents of the window containing the condition that requires an alert.
I believe the document-centric UI is the winner in theory, but the Macintosh UI is still inferior to Windows in many ways.
You can criticize Mac OS (X) for its lack of a maximize button, but you can’t pretend that it has one and then complain that it doesn’t work properly. That’s a straw-man argument. Also, if you don’t like dealing with a specific window right now, and simply ignoring it is somehow too much mental effort for you, you can minimize it, use virtual desktops, or use a utility that covers up anything except the currently active window/app. On the Mac, you even have the distinction between minimizing windows and hiding an app. There’s a tool that auto-hides apps you haven’t touched in a while. And if that still isn’t enough for you and you want maximizing or other custom behaviour, it’s super easy to assign an AppleScript for that to some hotkey. You don’t need to make the script yourself, e.g. have a look at Spooky.
So, getting what you want is a non-issue. If the current default behaviour is really the best default behaviour there can be is another question. Until all your favourite apps are tailored to take some different behaviour into account, the answer to that question is yes.
The cool thing about OSX is that Apple is never wrong. Thus their OS rocks totally, and kicks Windows’ ass.
They predicted people will be using 2500x1600 displays in their first Macintosh and designed this item just the way it should work in 2015.
And quit calling the ‘randomize my window size’ button, ‘maximize’, OK?
And don’t get me started on right mouse buttons and resizing windows by the edges. Boy, some people just don’t get it.
Tom Dibble, I just mean that maximizing the window functions as a “fix” for the Fitt’s Law violation of having the menu attached to the app window instead of the screen. You can always whip your mouse to (close to) the top of the screen and hit the menu. I do not believe it is a strict violation of Fitt’s law to have a menu not directly at the top of the screen, it’s just better than an unmaximized windows and not as good as the MacOS in this regard. As I understand it, Fitt’s law just measures the ease.
Slightly off-topic, I have always felt that the MacOS opposition to tooltips was misguided. I opened iMovie the other day, and the icons mean nothing to me. Saying “tooltips should be unnecessary if you are using understandable icons” only really works when the icons are, you know, understandable. On Windows, brushing over the icon would have given me a tooltip telling me in English what the !@#% icon does. The only reason I bring this up is because I do not believe that OS X sets the standard for usability or consistency as is CONSTANTLY claimed, and I desire to undermine this claim every time it is brought up. I say this as a Macintosh user.
Not everything you do in a window requires using the menu bar, of course. But I’ve never seen someone do these four things more than they use the menu bar.
Of course, you quite conviniently forget the increased popularity of toolbars both in Windows and in OSX. Vista is going further, Office 2007 even more so with the complete removal of the menus.
Indeed, I wouldn’t be surprised if people used start menu, minimize and close about the same (or just under) the amount they use the file menu (people rarely use maximize as most windows just end up maximized and staying that way).
The main interaction with an application is usually the content, and then any common functional manipulation on the content should be in the toolbar. The only time I really see people using the drop down menus is when they don’t realise a common function they want is in the toolbar, if they want to print with the print dialog showing, or if they want to do something slightly obscure/change the options.